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The following paper takes the seminal elements of a cancelled debate between the author, a critic of collapse thinkers, and Vincent Mignerot, president of the foresight association Adrastia, which aim is to adapt, as ethically as possible, to the global collapse of our thermo-industrial civilization. It builds them into the form of a self-interview, which deals successively with the media-friendly aspect of “collapsology,” the way it opens up ecology to the masses, the split between scientific reason and emotions, the fuzzy meaning of the very notion of “collapse,” the link between collapsology and the pressure to be relisient and finally the technocratic management of “transition.” Against such a mutilated ecology, which supports an industrial greenwashing, the author puts forth an alternate genealogy of ecology, the anti-industrial one, for which he suggests the name “naturians.”